Garee.pk siphoning Pakwheels.com data.

43 Comments

• Asim Kareem

  March 11, 2011
  12:23 am

  Nice article to cover ethical issue: I suspect that most links you covered didn’t have images so its possible that Garee.pk simply copied the data
• Asim

  March 11, 2011
  1:37 am

  Nothing unethical about it. They used “public” data to contact users and ask them if they want to post ads. There is no evidence that they simply “scrapped” the data. In fact, they called you to ask if it’s okay to post an ad on their site. How is that even remotely unethical – quite the opposite actually.

  In any case, they are providing an alternative service and leveraging their team and infrastructure to acquire market share – though Pakwheels has all the rights to whine and cry foul.

  Qazi, it would be nice if instead of posting Pakwheel’s opinion you would post your own. The fact is, Rozee asked your permission and probably asked everyone else too – how is that “stealing” information. The contact information is available publically.

  Disclaimer: I am not related to Pakwheels or Naseeb and don’t even use them.
• M. Hakim Ch

  March 11, 2011
  5:44 am

  Coincidentally I too was called by garee after posting an ad in Jang for my car.

  Garee is clearly using multiple public sources for lead generation to enter a new market, possibly including pakiwheels. There is no copyright violation. The ad was posted with my permission. Aggressive? Yes. Clever? Yes. Unethical? No.

  More choices creates competition. The consumer wins. Don’t cry. By posting this, you are giving an unknown site, garee.pk, a lot of publicity. Probably the opposite of what you want to do.
• Rizwan

  March 11, 2011
  5:50 am

  As SEO pls let me tell u that by posting garee.pk links, u are increasing sites pagerank.
• Asif Qayyum

  March 11, 2011
  6:08 am

  Here I wanted to mention that pakwheel copying rozee for jobs, see:

  http://www.pakwheels.com/blog/site-updates/new-features-pakwheels-com

  They even they copy rozee slogan I have seen on so many rozee riksha, “find a better job”.

  Pot calling kettle black?
• Qazi

  March 11, 2011
  8:16 am

  @Nasir, sorry had to remove your comment as it was only a personal attack with no relevance to the article.

  @Asim, I am not saying any one’s opinion I did say that as a user I would have been happy to learn that my add goes to another site without putting any effort, also I agree that they used public data. But thats what I am saying if instead of spending their efforts on re-posting PakWheels adds they had spent it on getting their existing rozee users advertise it it would have been better.

  @Hakim, same as i said that from a consumer I would be more than happy that this happened, and I am not crying just highlighting an event and discussing it, regarding giving publicity, I want to discuss an issue happening here i cant go about without taking names of the competing site. Ohh and I have no affiliation with either Garee.pk and Pakwheels.com

  @Asif, thanks for pointing it out, however I am not saying that because pakwheels got there first no other site should sell second hand cars, I am only trying to highlight the exact pulling of adds from their site.
• Qazi

  March 11, 2011
  9:21 am

  @Hakim, updated the post based on your info, thanks for letting us know, however still the ratio between adds from pakwheels and other sources is a huge, 15 of 20 adds from pak wheels and probably 5 from other sources
• Malik Jalal

  March 11, 2011
  10:34 am

  Qazi, I can say with a strong degree of confidence that the majority of your readers had probably never heard of of Garee.pk before you published this somewhat dramatically titled piece. I certainly had not.

  Please note that by another site using pakwheel’s publicly listed sellers for lead generation, ads are not “siphoned”, removed or “pulled” from pakwheels. They are cross listed, which I can certainly understand as being perceived as threatening to pakwheels, especially considering the muscle behind rozee. You contend that this will prevent the industry from growing — I would argue the opposite. Competition necessitates innovation for survival. Innovation results in growth.

  Pakwheels has a big head start, a clear advantage and an established community. Nothing can take that away from them. I would suggest embracing competition and capitalizing on one’s strengths rather than sensationalizing one’s business model vulnerabilities all over the net in a tabloid manner.
• farzal

  March 11, 2011
  10:37 am

  data scraping is here to stay. My ads on Rozee get copied to a zillion job search sites.

  so as owner of data, i lose control as soon as its on public domain!
• Asim Kareem

  March 11, 2011
  10:41 am

  @Hakim : I think there is difference between a competitor , who provides alternative to users ; and a clone / copy which simply copies your data and post on another site. I dont think so Garee.pk is adding any value to consumer. Let me give you few idea of cleverness and smartness

  @Asim & @Hakim : Lets think about few clever ideas to generate leads
  1. Go to shops who sell used cars , get their data and post. Give dealers address, and give them free marketing
  2. Give a 2000 advertisement in Jang, The News and all ads saying, if you are interested then post on our site
  3. Go and sponsor some car racing or car exhibition

  I fail to understand how copying data would come under smartness. Lets compete and not to copy someones’ else success

  @Qazi : Let’s put it this way. How would you feel, if i start copying your blog content and then paste on my site. I can pull data from various blogs and make aggregation and make money If i am not wrong, this is considered un-ethical in blogging world.

  In my fair opinion : This act would destroy the startup culture within Pakistan. While healthy competition is good, but taking benefit of other’s effort is clearly un-ethical.

  @Qazi : We need to analyze Rozee.pk history as well. The company did similar stuff , while i partnered for Job Fairs and none of the partners are with Rozee.pk as of today. Not only this, Rozee.pk , got huge grant for developing university job boards; which in my opinion should require investigations, as that was a total misuse of funds.

  I request that the copying to be stopped immediately by Garee.pk or pakboard.pk (if they are retaliating by doing so ).
• Malik Jalal

  March 11, 2011
  10:58 am

  @Asim Kareem: Flawed logic my friend. Copying a blog is violation of copyright. Posting data with permission of the content owner, is legal, beneficial and to be encouraged and commended.
• Qazi

  March 11, 2011
  10:58 am

  @Malik Jalal, I agree that i probably gave more publicity to Garee.pk however I don’t think that Rozee needed the meager traffic from my blog to increase their traffic ratings, if they convert a small percent of rozee.pk visits it would have been enough, Also my aim is not to go against Garee.pk as a business, or I am not owner or stake holder of Pakwheels.com to push down their competitors by not taking names or providing links.
  Also if the description of the adds on Garee.pk is exactly the same as Description (i am talking about textual description that a user writes him self like one hand driven, great condition etc) with exact words and phrases, then yes they copied the whole add from them(With permission of original user who posted it). (remember they did not ask any added description from me as they already had it from Pakwheels.com)

  @Asim Kareem, we can cover the history of Rozee.pk but for that I need some one to come forward and tell what happened, the Jobfair thing I have heard from multiple sources each with his own version of stories, and we need to hear both sides to understand the history, till that happens I wont be able to do a proper post on it as it would only be a rumor post without any actual facts.

  What ever happened back there we do admit that Rozee.pk is head and shoulders above the competition in job market, by sheer number of size and number of users. How effective that is is another story.
• Asim Kareem

  March 11, 2011
  11:07 am

  @Malik Jalal : I dont think so its a flawed argument : Like stealing content, its stealing customers. You need to follow whole argument line, cant pick one sentence in alone. Your response is pullting statement out of context.

  How would Rozee.pk feel, if I pull all the data from their Database and sell it at my own ? I definitely consider this as a CHEAP & Lazy Tactic by Garee.pk and i demand the site to be banned by PTCL and Rozee.pk should be shut down.
• Malik Jalal

  March 11, 2011
  11:41 am

  @Asim Kareem: Yes, that’s very logical once again. Let’s shut down rozee because garee is competing with pakwheels. And let’s get PTCL to do our bidding because it is great at stifling competition, preventing freedom of speech, providing lousy service and blocking websites at the whims of individuals with ulterior motives. (You probably meant PTA, btw).

  Sellers are not “owned” by anyone, and therefore cannot be stolen. Business is competitive. I say if you can’t take the heat, get out of the kitchen. Stop whining, please.
• Asim Kareem

  March 11, 2011
  11:52 am

  @Malik Jalal : Lets get rid of copy cats to promote innovation. Lets people move and shake, and learn some basic marketing ; as opposed to sitting on computers and copy ads You again wrongly used “Freedom of Speech” phrase – your freedom ends where my nose begins.

  Business is about innovation, solving people real problem as oppose to copying and cloning. Lets apply innovation and build stronger brands.
• Asim

  March 11, 2011
  2:15 pm

  Asim Kareem,

  Garee is ASKING permission of users and not “scraping” data. How hard is that for you to understand? Keeping ad copy same is also okay, how many variations can you have for a typical car spec?

  It’s time for pakwheels to stop whining and start competiting. Garee has started an amazing marketing effort and like their other ventures, this may be successful too.

  There is no such thing called “stealing customers” like mentioned above. The examples of marketing campaigns you have mentioned are “traditional” marketing campaigns – why should an enterpreneur not think out-of-the box to acquire customers.

  I will give you an example. When SalesForce.com was launched, their biggest competitor was Siebel. There was this Siebel partner event in Nice (France) where people had to take a 45 minute taxi to go from airport to the venue. What Salesforce did was, it hired ALL taxis and put their marketing collateral in those. Also it put in each taxi, their own sales rep! So all the Siebel customers who came, they had to listen to Salesforce guys for 45 minutes before they reached the venue – and sure enough a lot of them moved to Salesforce (it has more the a billion dollar revenue now!). This is simple “Guerrilla Marketing”, appreciate it, don’t cry fowl. If you are part of Pakwheels then you better get your act right coz now you may have a real competitor (though in my opinion, neither of you are going to make any reasonable revenue in short term – so the competition is actually not very useful from business point of view).

  @Qazi, the reason I mentioned pakwheels’ view is because the story basically reiterated what one of Pakwheel’s owner mentioned somewhere (twitter or fb, not sure – someone sent me the link). The title in my view could have been: “Pakwheels has a new aggressive competitor” and you could write the whole story from a neutral point of view – however, your blog, your decision and it’s fine like this too
• Qazi

  March 11, 2011
  2:57 pm

  @Asim, I would be honest, I started investigating it when I read that too.

  I would have used the term Aggregating and not Siphoning if half of the adds were not linked back to PakWheels, but if 15/20 of their latest Adds including the featured ones (they could have left out the featured adds) are taken from PakWheels then its simply not right.

  Ohh and thanks for the Sales Force story I was not aware of it
• Asim Kareen

  March 11, 2011
  3:06 pm

  Asim : I am glad you googled for some stuff. I will have you spend few minutes to Goolge on Ethical Marketing as well. I have a simply advice for you to test “Gorilla Market”, i.e. Go to Liberty and lets walk in to “ENEM”. Start Distributing “HKB” brochure and see how people appreciate your Gorilla Marketing Tactics. Let all of us about the outcome.

  The rationale thinking behind calling this “stealing customer”, is basically stealing on premises like you went on to someone else forum picked information and used for the purpose that wasn’t intended by anyone.
  Lets not cover lazy tactics by giving a fancy name like “Gorilla Marketing”. It better to respect competitors as well.

  There are other better examples of non-traditional marketing i.e. introducing funny video’s, social media. Lets build products and compete internationally, as oppose to applying Gorilla Tactis Amongst each other.

  @Qazi: Agressive is nice , good word. Lets not cover this act by sugar quoted words.
• Asim

  March 11, 2011
  3:34 pm

  Asim Kareem,

  Again you are wrong. I’ll give you another REAL world example from same salesforce.com story. On the day of launch (in 1999) they threw a party in SF. Downtown, Siebel was having it’s own party. As we know SalesForce has this logo “No Software”, so SalesForce sent a few guys down with playcards which had “No Software” written on them. Obviously there was a commotion. On top of it, some siebel executives called police which couldn’t really do anything as SalesForce had permission! So what happened was a lot of siebel execs and partners ended up coming to SalesForce party as well (as the guys with no software playcards also distributed invites. Furthermore, newspapers covered the whole thing which got SalesForce free publicity.

  Even in the case of Enem and HKB, i think it could be a great idea. Enem wouldn’t appreciate it (and HKB doesnt need it), but it would be great anyway. This doesn’t have anything to with ethics. Unethical would be if garee.pk would look EXACTLY like pakwheels, and took a domain pakwheeels (with an extra e) or something similar. That would be unethical. Calling customers from jang and pakwheels is perfectly okay – however, you have your own opinion and we have our own. It doesn’t really matter (though if you are responsible for marketing for your company it would be a good idea to start thinking out of the box :)) Meanwhile, let’s sit back and enjoy the competition.

  @Qazi, why should they leave out featured ads? They called customers who gave them permission. The same customers paid pakwheels for having the featured ads in pakwheels – in my view they are premium customers and garee.pk should actually give them a priority treatment (somehow). My point was only that Garee.pk is perfectly legit and what they are doing is pretty smart. They are incumbents and Pakwheels is the market leader. The market leader is cryig foul that an incumbent is aggressively taking their customers.

  By the way, people frequently bid on google on competitor keywords. Is that illegal too? Why not? If you are looking for Sony MP3, why can’t i show my own iPod ad? Is that stealing (potential) customers too?

  On a different note, if you hire a person from a certain company and then ask him to identify best people in his PREVIOUS company and give them competing offers – does that come under “employee stealing”? Is that unethical? Does one company “own” its customers and employees?

  Pakwheels “created” the market so can’t incumbents approach all pakwheels users and ask them to check out alternatives? If not, why not? The market is developed, and it has changed. This is a typical threat any “first-to-market” player has to face. Pakwheels should have known this before it was bought by current owners.
• Asim Kareen

  March 11, 2011
  4:52 pm

  Asim: Glad to brougt up the example, And in 1999 SugarCRM did that exactly same with Sales Force by attacking the CEO ( personally ) and his product. This helped SugarCRM and industry kept thinking should we market at our events or at someone else events. Remember what the media commented about it: It can work , however
  “The problem of course is…you’ll look like a pirate”

  Even from US Standards, you have looked like a Pirate. This tactic is used by startups, who can afford to risk their reputation.

  Also, i am sure you are not taking culture and norms, which defines ethics and morals for nations as well. Try out HKB and share your story with us. Trust me, they will not have to wait till the police come.

  So to sum Up: Is this legal ( I guess so) . Is this etical ( I dis-agree , which is debateable ). How would people and companies respond ( Yet to be seen).

  @Qazi: It would be good if we can comments by PakWheels as well. And keep us posted how PakWheel respond with Gorilla Marketing
• 

  March 11, 2011
  8:55 pm

  wow. it was a good discussion after a long time thank you every one who stopped by and gave us your opinion. and best of all except one comment all were constructive and discussed the issue at hand. These are the disfussions which make me realize the value of efforts behind this.

  i will not draw a conclusion because the community decides.
• B Zuberi

  March 12, 2011
  1:52 pm

  Maybe Pakwheels can learn a thing or two from new competitors turning this market into a real business. Despite its early traction, Pakwheels is not making any appreciable revenue. For a classifieds site that leads a category (cars), it is disappointing that Pakwheels makes more money from picking up advertising scraps than transactional revenue from sellers. Look what happened when rozee entered the otherwise crowded job classifieds market. No one was making any real money in it. Now rozee is making over $1 Million USD and growing fast in transaction revenue. It was on the Harvard AllWorld Pakistan Fast Growth 25 list of the 25 fastest growing private companies in Pakistan. Pakistan needs real Internet entrepreneurs, not whiners.
• Asim

  March 12, 2011
  3:44 pm

  B Zuberi,

  1. Pakwheels is first and foremost a community site. They are now beginning to monetize the traffic via ads.

  2. Rozee did not enter a crowded space – the story goes that the owner built it because it couldn’t post the company ads. Rozee also raised $2 mil to build that traction via fairs and massive advertising campaigns – as opposed to that pakwheel is ALL ORGANIC.

  I don’t disagree with garee.pk’s tactics but your points are wrong. Pakwheels is not whining, they are discrediting a new competitor in the field – I say that’s brilliant rather than trying to compete directly (as brilliant as garee.pk calling their users for permission to post ads).

  Compared to pakwheels, as Qazi mentioned, Garee does not have any active community. In fact, pakwheels is probably THE most active online / offline community in Pakistan – I don’t know of any other community that has offline meetups that often. What that means is that for ad buyers, pakwheels provide a better value as they can be sure that all cars enthusiasts/buyers etc are going to be there. Furthermore, the moderators are all car lovers. Garee is just a classifieds site and even though they CAN post ads, they can’t make people pay for those ads because the traffic is just not as high quality as pakwheels. The high quality traffic can be “bought” too – but for that rozee will have to do a lot of investment (similar to what they did for rozee) but the returns in automobile verticals will be too low compared to jobs – so i doubt they are going to make any investments.

  Bottom line: pakwheels will stay the market leader. Garee will trail them by a huge margin.

  By the way just for perspective: garee.pk has half the traffic of apnigari.com which is less than one-third pakwheels which is half rozee.pk (but the last bit doesn’t matter much :))

  It’s not pakwheels who need to learn a thing or two, it’s rozee who needs to learn from pakwheels how to run local communities from pakwheels. Pakwheels is also entering classifieds including jobs space and it’s yet to be seen how it works out. In my opinion, Pakistani market is too small (from revenue point) for either one of them (I don’t think Rozee makes 1 million from jobs either – most probably 40-70% of 1 million USD, looking at hotjobs and other premium services). This is also the main reason why there are no other players in the market – returns are just not there (though a pakwheels insider can put a better light on that).
• Asra Nadeem

  March 15, 2011
  1:30 pm

  As an online services specialist, I find Garee.pk’s lead generation model rather clever and interesting. Naseeb Networks is one of the most profitable online products company in Pakistan for a reason; internet is its core business and it utilizes various market segments to expand in a rather competitive way. Their sales strategy shows that they have a team of people behind this activity and the consumers will eventually benefit from the competition in the market.

  In other news they recently partnered with Express Tribune Classifieds. Do we see Dawn crying because it has been in the industry for longer?

  Bing copies data from Google and shows the same search strings. When you put your underwear out to dry without cloth-pegs, you can’t complain if string wind blows it away.
• Qazi

  March 15, 2011
  2:57 pm

  @Asra, thanks for stopping by,

  Partnering with Express Tribune Classified is one thing, copying Tribunes Classified Adds and re-posting it is completely another matter. And every one does agree that Consumer will benefit any way.

  And again they do have a team of people behind it but as mentioned by a reader, a better way to utilize that team (and I accept rozee has a larger sales network than many other online businesses) would have been to tap on the data of Car Dealers, visiting them and getting the data would have given them more benefit. But that team’s job currently seems to be skimming through classified and getting those adds on Garee.pk (After permission of the owner off course)

  Also there was huge hue and cry over the Bing Copying Google data

  Few references from Leading blogs and their take on this.

  http://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20030206-264.html
  
  
• Dua Hussain

  March 16, 2011
  11:51 am

  It’s of great concern to me being a start-up with an aim to follow market leaders like Naeeb Networks as an example of success that now not only they are degrading themselves with such acts, they are also defending their misdemeanors baselessly and shamelessly.

  It is really sad to know the thoughts of Ms. Asra who tried to moralize this issue with bad examples of Google vs. Bing (the matter is in court which clearly proves it was unethical practice of Bing. Court will decide if it is illegal as well). She also given an example of Express Tribune vs. Dawn and I am unable to comment on it because I can’t even understand what does this comparison means. Maybhe this was just a promotional move to hiligh their partnership with Express Tribune.

  Let’s first PLEASE accept it in black in white so that we may proceed to next step – the solution – that what Naseeb done (and if it is still doing) is not pleasant, digestible as business norm, acceptable or ignorable. IT IS WRONG!!. It has become our habit as an individual and as a nation that we go on wrong paths and once we reach dead end, instead of correcting ourselves, taking the right direction, we become totally DHEET and refuse to accept the failure or mistake. For God Sake, stop favoring wrong doings if you want to see this nation as glorious as it can be.

  ** Edited ** What I can not understand is that Asra knows the reasons behind the recent downfall of glorious Naseeb – recent massive layoffs, funding stoppage, inability to produce even one successful product after Rozee.pk, recent rumor of company buyout – then why does she still think all this is justified and instead of helping this company survive by pointing to the wrong decisions, she is helping it banish. Being market leader is something else, maintaining this position is something else and in the time of panic engaging yourself in ill-activities to maintain that position is something totally wrong.

  Last request, I know many of the commenter are Naseebers in disguise, please open your eyes and instead of proving this all siphoning activity is right, accept what is wrong otherwise make yourself ready for a steep moral downfall.
• Haseeb Janjua

  March 16, 2011
  12:27 pm

  @Asra, sorry to say but your underwear example was totally senseless, irrelevant, inappropriate rather disgusting.

  What’s wrong is wrong, and try to think higher than underwear level – sometimes.
• Haseeb Janjua

  March 16, 2011
  12:42 pm

  Copyright ©2011 GAREE.PK – All Rights Reserved. – A Division of Naseeb Networks, Inc..
  Reproduction of material from any GAREE.PK pages without permission is strictly prohibited.

  Permission = Naseeb Networks Permission.
  This proves the whole point. They steal data from other sites and copyright it to themselves. Kia baat hai aapki!!
• Zubair Anjum

  March 16, 2011
  4:09 pm

  Well, as far as I remember, the very foundation of Naseeb Networks started with so called mispiration – copying the internet business models from abroad and stealing the data from local competitors. Since you have Standford’s tag attached to you, no one will mind or doubt your ingenuity. But I will be honest if I say, Naseeb always showed lack of innovation you expect from top management coming straight from Stanford/Intel to conquer Pakistan.

  Remember the days of Naseeb.com? Stolen inspiration from Friendster, match.com and other lookalike. Why it completely failed and is thing of the past now? – Because inability to think innovative which Facebook did and slained Naseeb.com and hundreds of other copycats mercilessly. RIP!

  Rozee.pk was on shiny path of glory after copying data from brighspyre, mustakbil etc. – not because of innovation and thanks to strong corporate family background.

  They started Naksha, a stolen incomplete idea from Worldcall and it fell on knees – What you expect when you are reinventing the wheel without improvising it – lack of innovation.

  Garee.pk is the open case which proves that you will have to mind your ways and when Naseeb couldn’t hide their dark secrets of success and you know why? Because this is not 2003, this 2011 when every Pakistani is aware of internet ettiquetes and attaching itself to local internet brands. Any such rogue tactics would be lethal to any company in this point in time when you have well informed consumers.

  This is a wake up call!!!
• Qazi

  March 16, 2011
  4:28 pm

  @Dua, just edited small portion of your comment, as it seemed just a little bit in appropriate calling out the exact affiliations of some one.

  @Zubair, what ever we say Naseeb was a hit idea, they made loads of money not because they copied it but they were able to change it for a certain demographic and apply it properly, it was a great hit for muslims world wide, Naseeb was hit by FaceBook just like myspace and orkut has almost gone into oblivion, I wont say Naseeb’s failure had any thing to do with their own innovation its was a direct reason of FaceBook turning this market upside down.

  Similarly rozee.pk is again a success story, Some one bringing an idea successfully executed and molding it to local culture is not a copy, And I do with one readers comment above that Rozee was one of the few ones who were able to make money out of the job market instead of relying on add revenues.
• Asim

  March 16, 2011
  9:29 pm

  Zubair and all others bashing Naseeb, how many successful startups or products do you have under your belt? You guys don’t make any sense whatsoever as pakwheels doesn’t make any sense in claiming that garee.pk is “stealling their customers”.

  You are the kind of people who would be crying if other companies try to hire your employees – calling it “stealing of employees”. If your competitor launches a successful business based on a us business, you will cry: they copied the idea.

  Rozee copied data from brightspyre and mustakbil.. ofcourse, you can say whatever you want on a blog comment, and frankly it doesn’t matter.

  Grow up guys … or don’t … as it doesn’t matter. You’ll always be whining behind your desks in your usual day jobs, where as, entrepreneurs like Naseeb will keep creating history.

  Qazi, in Google vs MS case, there were two clear sides of the story and you cannot mix them here. The issue there was that MS collected data FROM THEIR TOOLBAR which users EXPLICITLY ALLOWED THEM TO and when it appeared in bing results Google said it was wrong. Google gamed their toolbar! Google was wrong, MS was right – it wasn’t data copying – it was simply picking up “signals” from toolbar as to what is relevant data (clicked by users and shared with toolbar).

  Dua, stop protecting pakwheels blindly. Garee.pk is using a clever marketing technique and that’s about it – nothing more, nothing less.
• Rana

  March 17, 2011
  7:02 pm

  I would agree with Zubair Anjum to some extent, there is no innovation in Naseeb’s ideas, the only good thing I see is that they execute their plans very professionally which others in the industry unforunately could not.
  Now coming towards copying of data, it is true that Rozee.pk started by copying data from other websites, similar is the case with bastee and now garee. Why can I say that? In early days of Rozee, we used to post jobs on Pak Jobs IT group on Yahoo (I hope you remember the good old times when this was the most popular group for IT job seekers) and could get the desired results easily for software engineers, our account was automatically created on Rozee and emailed to us. Then calls started coming. Bastee is not my personal experience but a coleague told me that he posted his property for sale on Zameen.com and received a call from Bastee for posting. His ad was also posted on Bastee without his concensus. Now coming towards Garee, they are not only copying data from Pakwheels, they are copying from another well known site Apnigari.com check the proof here:
  http://www.garee.pk/detail/_Honda_Civic_2005_Model_For_Sale/2842
  http://www.apnigari.com/Pakistan/Cars/Honda/Used_Honda_Civic_Exi_Prosmatec_model_2005_for_sale_in_Karachi_93052.html

  http://www.garee.pk/detail/Black_Toyota_Corolla_2009_Model_For_Sale/2831
  http://www.apnigari.com/Pakistan/Cars/Toyota/Used_Toyota_Corolla_Xli_model_2009_for_sale_in_Lahore_88514.html

  I am sure there might be more, another thing I noticed, they are using the exact same logos for cars as used by Apnigari.com! I am not saying that they cannot use Toyota logo on their site, but come on, there are dozens of variations and pictures of logos available, why use the exact same logo as on Apnigari.com.
  The bottom line, I am not against Naseeb or favoring any other site, I think that Naseeb is by far the most professional company in web business in Pakistan and should try to be more innovative and original in their ideas.
• B Zuberi

  March 22, 2011
  10:55 am

  I’ve noticed that this blog is quite biased against rozee from the beginning. It has been towing Britespyre’s line and now is regurgitating Pakwheel’s non-sense. The title itself says it all. Why is it that Pakistanis like to pull down their own once they achieve success? We need to break out of this inferiority complex. Someone above just pushed five different rumors in one sentence of rozee’s impending demise. This is negative, ridiculous and disgusting. Rozee is one of Pakistan’s fastest growing 25 private companies. It is doing extremely well:

  http://www.allworldlive.com/asia-500/winners/2011-pakistan-25

  And please learn what siphoning and stealing means. Get a dictionary. The blog author himself admits that permission was sought and consented to. Stop crying. Here’s a tissue. Stand up, and march forward. These highly biased blogs may get you comments but keep the credibility of Green & White very suspect.
• Qazi

  March 22, 2011
  11:47 am

  @B Zuberi, Thanks for commenting on the story, I had no intention to get rozee involved into this, and I immediately deleted (and edited) any comment that had a personal attack on Rozee or Monis Rehman, I gave a point of view on some thing which from my standpoint was not the best way to do a thing. (Please see i mention multiple time its not illegal) I reported a story as it happened to me, with a two line opinion at the end,
  You have your opinion and I respect that, and similarly there are other people in the thread who have their own opinion about what happened.
  Its not a bias just whats happening, I said in the comments what Monis has done at Rozee is phenomenal, he has changed the Job Classified industry which still manages mostly on Adsense revenues into some thing profitable, and his achievement should not be undermined, also I also said that with Rozee.pk’s traffic at their disposal they could have gone about it in few different ways as well.

  I think having a competitor is a good thing I have also said in the post that having this is beneficial for customers/consumers. Just the way the data is being populated is not some thing I liked
• Qazi

  March 22, 2011
  11:52 am

  @B Zuberi, and let me assure you no part of what I do is for traffic generation, it just some thing I take on as a personal mission to keep this thing going,

  If the intent was to build comments and traffics, there are a lot of juicy conspiracy theories and inside stories which would bring loads of hate comments, and followup traffic.
• Asim Kareen

  March 24, 2011
  9:13 pm

  @Asim : How many startups have you done ? I know you are someone who is getting his paycheck from Rozee for un-etchical activities and trying to justify. Good luck with your next pay check and increment.

  @Qazi : Best summary was by “Haseeb Janjua”
  “Copyright ©2011 GAREE.PK – All Rights Reserved. – A Division of Naseeb Networks, Inc..
  Reproduction of material from any GAREE.PK pages without permission is strictly prohibited.”

  @Arsa & Zuberi : This may worth debating and you have all the right to defend the act and apologies. You may wish to check authenticity of “Naseeb” networks which is “Mulsims Dating Site”. You may wisht check with a religious scholar on this, would it be ethical to work for a company with such intentions ? I am not implying anything, but just suggesting you to check with someone.

  There are lots of issues with Naseeb and its sub-sideraries. I think its a time to bash them now
• Asim

  March 25, 2011
  1:37 am

  @asim kareen, I run a successful startup and know pakwheels and garee.pk owners personally

  You can have your own opinion on this and feel good about it, but i still believe there was nothing unethical about garee.pk.

  Your bashing of Naseeb doesn’t really matter.

  Btw, naseeb is NOT a dating site. It’s a “matrimonial” site (ofcourse you can date before you marry but thats upto you :)). At least read the site content before posting things – it makes you look stupid if nothing else
• Asim Kareen

  March 25, 2011
  3:19 pm

  @Asim : Really Glad to hear. I hope you are ethical in your startup atleast.

  For your little information, you need to have Shariah’s verdict before you start naming it “Muslim’s Matrimonial or Dating Site”. Just do some research before you make another stupid comment. Quote some religious scholar, like you quoted “Sales Force” Good luck with your research.
• Qazi

  March 25, 2011
  5:59 pm

  I just found some of the comments were marked as spam, posted them again, sorry for the delay.

  Also just as a guide line if you include a lot of links in your comments it gets marked as spam
• used cars in pakistan

  April 21, 2011
  12:38 pm

  we are surprised with it if they are doing it, i also launched my site http://www.atoz.pk some times some person comes and do that same thing on our site but we are not pulling the data from any site. and if any site add is showing on our site the it added by the used not by us.