Comments on: Just enough Project Management? http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/ Coffee Sessions for the Industry! Sat, 12 May 2012 08:39:15 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Salman, Kh http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12478 Salman, Kh Thu, 12 Jun 2008 04:35:02 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12478 @ mansoor: I would rather start off with the simple measurements. "Planned versus Actual" start and end dates for any task. Once this is performed, and logged, at the time of performing next estimation, we can always go to our logs and see to it, how much we estimated? Did we actually kept our word, or did we screw up the estimation completely. Next estimation must be an estimate, not a guesstimate. Generally, I have seen project managers, using guesstimates, and never logging these simple things. Result: always complaining about not able to manage projects. Off course, we need a real system like GTD, etcetera to do this. Also, I feel that Project Manager should be managing their own lives, not just projects assigned to them. @ mansoor:
I would rather start off with the simple measurements. “Planned versus Actual” start and end dates for any task.

Once this is performed, and logged, at the time of performing next estimation, we can always go to our logs and see to it, how much we estimated? Did we actually kept our word, or did we screw up the estimation completely. Next estimation must be an estimate, not a guesstimate.

Generally, I have seen project managers, using guesstimates, and never logging these simple things. Result: always complaining about not able to manage projects.

Off course, we need a real system like GTD, etcetera to do this.

Also, I feel that Project Manager should be managing their own lives, not just projects assigned to them.

]]> By: mansoor http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12465 mansoor Wed, 11 Jun 2008 17:56:25 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12465 salman: thanks for your input. what sort of measurements would you recommend for budding PMs?? ansar: :) david: thanks for leaving a comment and not being a silent reader any longer. the veteran pm's i was talking about were from our own industry and although there isn't a authoratative study, the sample are those i've met personally. i'm all for lightweight, flexible PM strategies and thats precisely what i want to deduce... given the experiences we've had in our industry, what would constitute a good PM strategy and under what circumstances.. i hope this would give people a starting point to get PMship under control. sayB: please say whatever is on ur mind.. this is a place for sharing of idea's and we'll all be richer for it. one point i'd tend to agree with you a lot is the emotional state of employees, something which management isn't really keen to consider whenever considering productivity.... keep the idea's coming! ob: could you share more details about what exactly is your change management system? if you could share a high level process map for it...? salman: thanks for your input. what sort of measurements would you recommend for budding PMs??

ansar: :)

david: thanks for leaving a comment and not being a silent reader any longer. the veteran pm’s i was talking about were from our own industry and although there isn’t a authoratative study, the sample are those i’ve met personally. i’m all for lightweight, flexible PM strategies and thats precisely what i want to deduce… given the experiences we’ve had in our industry, what would constitute a good PM strategy and under what circumstances.. i hope this would give people a starting point to get PMship under control.

sayB: please say whatever is on ur mind.. this is a place for sharing of idea’s and we’ll all be richer for it. one point i’d tend to agree with you a lot is the emotional state of employees, something which management isn’t really keen to consider whenever considering productivity…. keep the idea’s coming!

ob: could you share more details about what exactly is your change management system? if you could share a high level process map for it…?

]]> By: Ansar Muhammad http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12453 Ansar Muhammad Wed, 11 Jun 2008 11:52:50 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12453 Thanks for the advice ob! It is a long painful story. We have a paid godaddy.com account but made the mistake of using the free "website tonight" software that came with the purchase Will do something about it soon :) Thanks for the advice ob!

It is a long painful story. We have a paid godaddy.com account but made the mistake of using the free “website tonight” software that came with the purchase

Will do something about it soon :)

]]> By: ob http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12426 ob Tue, 10 Jun 2008 14:28:31 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12426 I think we need to realize that at different stage different techniques are needed. Project management should be flexible and adaptable to the change.. We have a change control system, we meet every week to see what change requests are in the system and we evaluate them based on team inputs. If there is a developer estimate needed before we can make a decision we do that as well. We use our in-house custom developed software for managing all the changes and so far it has been extremely flexible. just my 2cents... btw Ansar you might wanna move out from free hosting to something more decent for the site. The minute it loads up with that banner at the top it just discourages me to even consider the company for my next project.. just a friendly advice .. :) I think we need to realize that at different stage different techniques are needed. Project management should be flexible and adaptable to the change..

We have a change control system, we meet every week to see what change requests are in the system and we evaluate them based on team inputs. If there is a developer estimate needed before we can make a decision we do that as well.

We use our in-house custom developed software for managing all the changes and so far it has been extremely flexible.

just my 2cents…

btw Ansar you might wanna move out from free hosting to something more decent for the site. The minute it loads up with that banner at the top it just discourages me to even consider the company for my next project.. just a friendly advice .. :)

]]> By: SayB http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12408 SayB Mon, 09 Jun 2008 20:37:03 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12408 Thanks Dave, you said what I was feeling reluctant to. Although I am a big fan of PMBOK in "theory" as it gives you a lot of knowledge, in the end you'll loose your creativity in problem solving if you try to "follow" a book or even a particular approach. You'd have to come up with your own way to solve things. Best solutions end up being a hybrid of different approaches. Variables in the real world change a lot faster than we might think. There are procedures to do things that can be bended for the better. So yes, "just enough project management" is variable subject to a lot of "changing" factors involved, people being one of them. Heck! emotional states of your team members matter too much, especially when you are subject to a high employee turnover rate (like the IT industry here) and you know it's hard to find good help immediately. Thanks Dave, you said what I was feeling reluctant to. Although I am a big fan of PMBOK in “theory” as it gives you a lot of knowledge, in the end you’ll loose your creativity in problem solving if you try to “follow” a book or even a particular approach. You’d have to come up with your own way to solve things. Best solutions end up being a hybrid of different approaches.

Variables in the real world change a lot faster than we might think. There are procedures to do things that can be bended for the better. So yes, “just enough project management” is variable subject to a lot of “changing” factors involved, people being one of them. Heck! emotional states of your team members matter too much, especially when you are subject to a high employee turnover rate (like the IT industry here) and you know it’s hard to find good help immediately.

]]> By: David Christiansen http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12401 David Christiansen Mon, 09 Jun 2008 19:33:33 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12401 First of all, veteran project managers in the software industry do not agree that PMBOK style project management is a good thing. There are many, including myself, who believe it is a bad thing. It is wasteful, cumbersome, and hopelessly unrealistic to apply the PMBOK approach to software development projects. Building software isn't like building houses, which is what PMBOK is derived from. You'll be better off with a more lightweight, more flexible project management approach like Scrum, XP, or other agile approaches. Read Manage It! by Johanna Rothman, or any book by Mary Poppendieck and you'll learn more. Nice blog, btw. I've been following you for quite some time, as I'm interested in viewpoints of the software industry from around the world. Dave First of all, veteran project managers in the software industry do not agree that PMBOK style project management is a good thing. There are many, including myself, who believe it is a bad thing. It is wasteful, cumbersome, and hopelessly unrealistic to apply the PMBOK approach to software development projects. Building software isn’t like building houses, which is what PMBOK is derived from. You’ll be better off with a more lightweight, more flexible project management approach like Scrum, XP, or other agile approaches. Read Manage It! by Johanna Rothman, or any book by Mary Poppendieck and you’ll learn more.

Nice blog, btw. I’ve been following you for quite some time, as I’m interested in viewpoints of the software industry from around the world.

Dave

]]> By: Ansar Muhammad http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12389 Ansar Muhammad Mon, 09 Jun 2008 07:18:16 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12389 Thanks Osama and Mansoor! You are most welcome :) Regarding Mansoor's point about "communication" ... I second that!! Thanks Osama and Mansoor! You are most welcome :)

Regarding Mansoor’s point about “communication” … I second that!!

]]> By: Salman, Kh http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12383 Salman, Kh Mon, 09 Jun 2008 04:02:47 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12383 I would agree with the fact that we do have load of paradoxes for managing the project at our ends, but I would like to add here is that we, as a project manager don't even take the time nor effort to measure ourselves. Most Project Managers I have seen delve into more of communciation and negociation tasks, which might not project onto the tasks of measurement. @ RogerS: I would like to share the following links I have been using GanntPV for scheduling and tracking my projects and have found it a lot better than MS project http://www.pureviolet.net/ganttpv/index.html http://www.simpleprojectmanagement.com/forum/index.php?action=vthread&forum=3&topic=81 http://voo2do.com/ (For keeping a task list and measuring what was actual versus planned.) I would agree with the fact that we do have load of paradoxes for managing the project at our ends, but I would like to add here is that we, as a project manager don’t even take the time nor effort to measure ourselves. Most Project Managers I have seen delve into more of communciation and negociation tasks, which might not project onto the tasks of measurement.

@ RogerS:
I would like to share the following links

I have been using GanntPV for scheduling and tracking my projects and have found it a lot better than MS project

http://www.pureviolet.net/ganttpv/index.html

http://www.simpleprojectmanagement.com/forum/index.php?action=vthread&forum=3&topic=81

http://voo2do.com/ (For keeping a task list and measuring what was actual versus planned.)

]]> By: mansoor http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12359 mansoor Sun, 08 Jun 2008 07:46:27 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12359 ansar: i just saw the mention on your site too. thanks! ansar: i just saw the mention on your site too. thanks!

]]> By: mansoor http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/comment-page-1/#comment-12358 mansoor Sun, 08 Jun 2008 07:31:35 +0000 http://greenwhite.org/2008/06/06/just-enough-project-management/#comment-12358 ansar: as they say in the world of acting.. "there are no small parts, only small actors", i would like to adapt this to our own scenario. the saying would go something like this.. "there are no difficult projects, only difficult people" i wonder if anyone has ever done a study on what is the most failed aspect of project management? from what i've observed (and this is by no means scientific) the area of most dissent would be communication. ansar: as they say in the world of acting.. “there are no small parts, only small actors”, i would like to adapt this to our own scenario. the saying would go something like this.. “there are no difficult projects, only difficult people”

i wonder if anyone has ever done a study on what is the most failed aspect of project management? from what i’ve observed (and this is by no means scientific) the area of most dissent would be communication.

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