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	<title>Comments on: Zigron &#8211; An incubating partner as a business &#8211; looking for team members</title>
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	<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/</link>
	<description>Coffee Sessions for the Industry!</description>
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		<title>By: priceperheadbookmakingservices</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-143946</link>
		<dc:creator>priceperheadbookmakingservices</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 07:07:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-143946</guid>
		<description>Hello, can you talk more about this topic with me through PM? I love it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello, can you talk more about this topic with me through PM? I love it!</p>
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		<title>By: Salman Masud</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-95714</link>
		<dc:creator>Salman Masud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 11:18:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-95714</guid>
		<description>I came across this link and would like to correct &#039;Khan&#039; on a few matters here. Firstly, our recruitment process, though kept as informal as possible so that the interviewee may not feel nervous, does not contain words like &#039;yaar&#039;. Secondly, it&#039;s always easy to fabricate stories about interviews, as there really is no way to confirm them. 

As for your other point, certain companies are not looking for technology or language specific individuals. They&#039;re looking for individuals that can adapt, and not those who have all the theoretical knowledge in the world but have trouble writing simple algos or pseudo codes. The reason companies ask mathematical and IQ related questions is to gauge how quickly an individual can solve simple but not straightforward questions and then judge as to whether that person will be suitable for their company. Our belief is that strong mathematical skills are very important to become a good programmer with solid logic building skills. It is a practice that has worked well for us. For us, hiring a programmer isn&#039;t just about how much in-depth knowledge that person has of a particular tool, we look for individuals who can be given a problem at that very moment, and they can work their way around it, as there are no guarantees of which tool that person will be assigned to work in. Any expertise that individual brings beyond that is a bonus and is kept in mind when formulating teams.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I came across this link and would like to correct &#8216;Khan&#8217; on a few matters here. Firstly, our recruitment process, though kept as informal as possible so that the interviewee may not feel nervous, does not contain words like &#8216;yaar&#8217;. Secondly, it&#8217;s always easy to fabricate stories about interviews, as there really is no way to confirm them. </p>
<p>As for your other point, certain companies are not looking for technology or language specific individuals. They&#8217;re looking for individuals that can adapt, and not those who have all the theoretical knowledge in the world but have trouble writing simple algos or pseudo codes. The reason companies ask mathematical and IQ related questions is to gauge how quickly an individual can solve simple but not straightforward questions and then judge as to whether that person will be suitable for their company. Our belief is that strong mathematical skills are very important to become a good programmer with solid logic building skills. It is a practice that has worked well for us. For us, hiring a programmer isn&#8217;t just about how much in-depth knowledge that person has of a particular tool, we look for individuals who can be given a problem at that very moment, and they can work their way around it, as there are no guarantees of which tool that person will be assigned to work in. Any expertise that individual brings beyond that is a bonus and is kept in mind when formulating teams.</p>
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		<title>By: Zigron Inc. Blog &#187; PingMyCompany.com is launched</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-11361</link>
		<dc:creator>Zigron Inc. Blog &#187; PingMyCompany.com is launched</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 19:34:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-11361</guid>
		<description>[...] reading some really interesting comments on a post about Zigron Inc on Green &amp; White blog I decided that we need a site where people can share [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] reading some really interesting comments on a post about Zigron Inc on Green &amp; White blog I decided that we need a site where people can share [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Haris Khan</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-11359</link>
		<dc:creator>Haris Khan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 19:10:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-11359</guid>
		<description>From all this discussion it hit me that we should have a fun site where people can share their opinions both positive and negative about different firms.

So as fun project we just created a small site www.PingMyCompany.com for people to share their opinion about firms. Its more like a fun version of theFunded.com for companies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From all this discussion it hit me that we should have a fun site where people can share their opinions both positive and negative about different firms.</p>
<p>So as fun project we just created a small site <a href="http://www.PingMyCompany.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.PingMyCompany.com</a> for people to share their opinion about firms. Its more like a fun version of theFunded.com for companies.</p>
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		<title>By: mansoor</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9987</link>
		<dc:creator>mansoor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 12:30:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9987</guid>
		<description>khan: i&#039;d like to add a couple of more words here in the same vein as osama. every one of us here is part of the industry, running companies, managing companies and even working for companies. we write here because we feel it necessary to give back to the same community, to the same industry, that we came up from. 

we do not write for profit, fame or recognition (okay, a little fame is always nice but still!). and we&#039;re not journalists. while we will always try to uphold the ethics of professional journalism even while on this blog, and present both sides of a story as well as other stories of interest, this is not our career and we cannot be held accountable for &#039;missing out&#039; a certain story. 

lastly, please do mail in your comments, new story suggestions of even guest posts if you feel like it and i&#039;m sure we would give it due consideration.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>khan: i&#8217;d like to add a couple of more words here in the same vein as osama. every one of us here is part of the industry, running companies, managing companies and even working for companies. we write here because we feel it necessary to give back to the same community, to the same industry, that we came up from. </p>
<p>we do not write for profit, fame or recognition (okay, a little fame is always nice but still!). and we&#8217;re not journalists. while we will always try to uphold the ethics of professional journalism even while on this blog, and present both sides of a story as well as other stories of interest, this is not our career and we cannot be held accountable for &#8216;missing out&#8217; a certain story. </p>
<p>lastly, please do mail in your comments, new story suggestions of even guest posts if you feel like it and i&#8217;m sure we would give it due consideration.</p>
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		<title>By: Khan</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9981</link>
		<dc:creator>Khan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 07:37:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9981</guid>
		<description>@Osama

Boss! I am really impressed and appreciate your so professional but kind approach, hope other organizations must be reading it and learn something from it.

&quot;Ah and what do you know - Mansoor just published a story just like you were looking for.&quot;

It looks better if you write 
&quot;Ah and you know what!&quot; just kidding :D (but good to be intimate)

&quot;The constructive way of doing these things is to email us with a â€œCan you please cover this topic?â€ or with news from the ground so that we can cover it. &quot;

I will certainly do that from now on Inshallah!

&quot;Remember - you all need to be my field reporter so that it can benefit everyone here.&quot;

You got me, no doubt about that and will be there when come up with something new.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Osama</p>
<p>Boss! I am really impressed and appreciate your so professional but kind approach, hope other organizations must be reading it and learn something from it.</p>
<p>&#8220;Ah and what do you know &#8211; Mansoor just published a story just like you were looking for.&#8221;</p>
<p>It looks better if you write<br />
&#8220;Ah and you know what!&#8221; just kidding <img src='http://greenwhite.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />  (but good to be intimate)</p>
<p>&#8220;The constructive way of doing these things is to email us with a â€œCan you please cover this topic?â€ or with news from the ground so that we can cover it. &#8221;</p>
<p>I will certainly do that from now on Inshallah!</p>
<p>&#8220;Remember &#8211; you all need to be my field reporter so that it can benefit everyone here.&#8221;</p>
<p>You got me, no doubt about that and will be there when come up with something new.</p>
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		<title>By: Osama A.</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9966</link>
		<dc:creator>Osama A.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 14:18:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9966</guid>
		<description>What is certainly incorrect though is to expect someone to write what we WANT to hear - i.e. something that only reaffirms our point of view.

Usually what we should be hearing isnt what we WANT to hear to feel good - thats why learning, growing, moving ahead, evolving, maturing is hard - it often goes against what we want.

We&#039;ll cover objective stories whenever they are reported from the front-lines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What is certainly incorrect though is to expect someone to write what we WANT to hear &#8211; i.e. something that only reaffirms our point of view.</p>
<p>Usually what we should be hearing isnt what we WANT to hear to feel good &#8211; thats why learning, growing, moving ahead, evolving, maturing is hard &#8211; it often goes against what we want.</p>
<p>We&#8217;ll cover objective stories whenever they are reported from the front-lines.</p>
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		<title>By: Osama A.</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9965</link>
		<dc:creator>Osama A.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 13:46:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9965</guid>
		<description>Ah and what do you know - Mansoor just published a story just like you were looking for. Coincidence!

The constructive way of doing these things is to email us with a &quot;Can you please cover this topic?&quot; or with news from the ground so that we can cover it.

Remember - you all need to be my field reporter so that it can benefit everyone here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah and what do you know &#8211; Mansoor just published a story just like you were looking for. Coincidence!</p>
<p>The constructive way of doing these things is to email us with a &#8220;Can you please cover this topic?&#8221; or with news from the ground so that we can cover it.</p>
<p>Remember &#8211; you all need to be my field reporter so that it can benefit everyone here.</p>
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		<title>By: Osama A.</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9964</link>
		<dc:creator>Osama A.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 13:33:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9964</guid>
		<description>Hi Khan,

Thanks for this better worded comment.

We have covered the types of things you are talking about in the past, please read these:

http://greenwhite.wordpress.com/2007/03/27/why-people-are-afraid-of-becoming-coders-and-what-companies-need-to-do-about-it/

http://greenwhite.org/2007/08/10/rumor-dps-lays-off-130-people-at-1-hour-notice/

Our role is to raise awareness wherever it may make a difference.

However, in addition our role is also to help EVERYONE prepare for the modern world. E.g. take a look at all these posts Mansoor is doing about process improvement... this is meant for companies to grow up, not for startups or employees.

But we also need to talk about how layoffs are a natural part of business and it doesnt make a firm &quot;evil&quot; - this is meant for employees to grow up, not startups or companies.

This is just 50 people even large companies like Yahoo and AOL and others have had times when they had to lay off 3000+ employees, close down departments, reshift focus in order to keep competitive in a ever-growing competitive playing field. 

The truth is that while in the short term this unfairly affects the employees, in the long term it gives those employees a chance to use their skills and experience at those firms to start companies with unique advantages for success.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Khan,</p>
<p>Thanks for this better worded comment.</p>
<p>We have covered the types of things you are talking about in the past, please read these:</p>
<p><a href="http://greenwhite.wordpress.com/2007/03/27/why-people-are-afraid-of-becoming-coders-and-what-companies-need-to-do-about-it/" rel="nofollow">http://greenwhite.wordpress.com/2007/03/27/why-people-are-afraid-of-becoming-coders-and-what-companies-need-to-do-about-it/</a></p>
<p><a href="http://greenwhite.org/2007/08/10/rumor-dps-lays-off-130-people-at-1-hour-notice/" rel="nofollow">http://greenwhite.org/2007/08/10/rumor-dps-lays-off-130-people-at-1-hour-notice/</a></p>
<p>Our role is to raise awareness wherever it may make a difference.</p>
<p>However, in addition our role is also to help EVERYONE prepare for the modern world. E.g. take a look at all these posts Mansoor is doing about process improvement&#8230; this is meant for companies to grow up, not for startups or employees.</p>
<p>But we also need to talk about how layoffs are a natural part of business and it doesnt make a firm &#8220;evil&#8221; &#8211; this is meant for employees to grow up, not startups or companies.</p>
<p>This is just 50 people even large companies like Yahoo and AOL and others have had times when they had to lay off 3000+ employees, close down departments, reshift focus in order to keep competitive in a ever-growing competitive playing field. </p>
<p>The truth is that while in the short term this unfairly affects the employees, in the long term it gives those employees a chance to use their skills and experience at those firms to start companies with unique advantages for success.</p>
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		<title>By: Khan</title>
		<link>http://greenwhite.org/blog/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/comment-page-1/#comment-9958</link>
		<dc:creator>Khan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 07:32:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://greenwhite.org/2008/04/01/zigron-an-incubating-partner-as-a-business-looking-for-team-members/#comment-9958</guid>
		<description>@Salman

Yeh, you are rite that I sounded harsh and its not a norm to ask this way. But let me get back to you how I found this blog and added it to my feeds. It was so many times here that Osama and Qazi always inspired how an employee should be more professional etc etc. Even in one post they suggested that Organizations should have a network so that they get previous employeer&#039;s views about new hirings. I always waited for a post here that would say...
&quot;IT startups and entrepreneurs if you want this business to be running and stabilizing, respect and reward your IT talent in this way, that way etc &quot;
So what do you think, how should I point them to such events, considering that I am not a startup or an entrepreneure but a software engineer? So let me ask it again, is this blog about startups and organizations only or we too are welcome here? Or should I just remove it from my feed readers, coz it got nothing for me?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Salman</p>
<p>Yeh, you are rite that I sounded harsh and its not a norm to ask this way. But let me get back to you how I found this blog and added it to my feeds. It was so many times here that Osama and Qazi always inspired how an employee should be more professional etc etc. Even in one post they suggested that Organizations should have a network so that they get previous employeer&#8217;s views about new hirings. I always waited for a post here that would say&#8230;<br />
&#8220;IT startups and entrepreneurs if you want this business to be running and stabilizing, respect and reward your IT talent in this way, that way etc &#8221;<br />
So what do you think, how should I point them to such events, considering that I am not a startup or an entrepreneure but a software engineer? So let me ask it again, is this blog about startups and organizations only or we too are welcome here? Or should I just remove it from my feed readers, coz it got nothing for me?</p>
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